Wed, 17 August 2005 This is our first full episode, in which we discuss Welcome to the Hellmouth and the Harvest and respond to our first email! Comments[13] |
I like your show, Revello, great new material for longtime fans.
As a fan of comic books and the horror and science fiction genres, it was refreshing to see a television product that was not afraid to build a complex, sustained mythology. I believe that mythology succeeded for many of the reasons that you cite, Revello.
The fact that these ground rules were established early allowed viewers to become quickly immersed. Yet it also offered the writers with the agility to surprise the audience with potentially difficult material, in the form of startling plot twists and also some very challenging dramatic moments that simply wouldn't fly on a show about Buffy the Dental Hygienist.
I quickly realized the someone was actually taking the complex narratives and continuities of the comic book world and placing them in the context of a popular television show about high school students.
The benefit to character drama here are apparent, especially when the seemingly fantastic events can actually be manipulated to serve as metaphors for character development.
Sure, it had comedy and drama and romantic angles, but it also had demons and vampires and fish monsters.
That's why I don't get The O.C. The O.C. has a Cordelia, it's got a Xander—-but no fish monsters.
As a fan of comic books and the horror and science fiction genres, it was refreshing to see a television product that was not afraid to build a complex, sustained mythology. I believe that mythology succeeded for many of the reasons that you cite, Revello.
The fact that these ground rules were established early allowed viewers to become quickly immersed. Yet it also offered the writers with the agility to surprise the audience with potentially difficult material, in the form of startling plot twists and also some very challenging dramatic moments that simply wouldn't fly on a show about Buffy the Dental Hygienist.
I quickly realized the someone was actually taking the complex narratives and continuities of the comic book world and placing them in the context of a popular television show about high school students.
The benefit to character drama here are apparent, especially when the seemingly fantastic events can actually be manipulated to serve as metaphors for character development.
Sure, it had comedy and drama and romantic angles, but it also had demons and vampires and fish monsters.
That's why I don't get The O.C. The O.C. has a Cordelia, it's got a Xander—-but no fish monsters.
Just listened to the podcast over my lunch. Very interesting and entertaining. I'm going to have to go back and review the 1st episode and the Willow/Cordelia moment, possibly great foreshadowing.
Are you going to have guests? What about topic suggestions? Is the Angel series, the Buffy books (of which I am of a varying opinion off), CDs, etc going to be discussed?
Can't wait to download ep. 3 so I can listen to it while jogging.
I n
Are you going to have guests? What about topic suggestions? Is the Angel series, the Buffy books (of which I am of a varying opinion off), CDs, etc going to be discussed?
Can't wait to download ep. 3 so I can listen to it while jogging.
I n
Thanks to all for listening! To answer your questions, Sarah: (1) we have the equipment for a multiperson format and may try it once we get our feet under us and find the right on-air bodies; (2) we'd love to receive topic suggestions from our audience, so send them in!; (3) for now, we're focusing on Buffy, although if there's a significant call for Angel material we may open things up. In any event, we will definitely reference the Angel crossover episodes when the discussion calls for it; (4) we don't plan on covering the books because the quality is uneven (as you imply) and we view them as somewhat removed from the television narrative. We're also still steamed we paid seven dollars for the un-spellchecked "Chosen"!
I just listened to the show, you mention a number of excellent points about the Vampire mythos introduced by the show. However you mention the idea that those beings of evil drawn to the Hellmouth do not know what to do there. You do later mention the constant string of disapearances as a place to suspend disbelief. If you remember the episode "Faith, Hope & Trick" Mr. Trick tells Kakistos that this town was built for them, that the city is able to withstand thier feeding without struggle. Also remember that the Mayor founded Sunnydale with the idea that he could feed on the townspeople, it seems built for sustaining the very evil it draws to it.
Also on the same sort of note Joss does ask us to suspend our disbelief about how the outrside world hasn't noticed this tinky black hole in Southern California. Every once in a while Joss does deal with this though it does remain a point of suspended disbelief. I can remember "Gingerbread" where the town starts gettign together to say enough is enough. Also in "Hush" the news cast says the town has fallen to larengytis and is quarantined. Niether of these are great explinations but they do deal with the issue somewhat making sure it's not the elephant in the living room.
I also loved your commentary on Angel. It is clear that Angel was given his backstory late in the game after he was already established a character. However since we as the audience are now forced to shoehorn Angel into his old character. The "kill them all" line seems to be far too forcefull however his fear of the Master seems justified. Since having his soul he would have the impact of some of the horrors of the Master's work. Also he was rather shell shocked when we saw him meet (stalk) Buffy the first time with Whistler so his fear of the world seems to come from that. However we don't seem to get into what happened to make the scared, rat eating creature that was Angel become the enigmatic, smooth, makeup clad protagonist (Hero just doesn't work for me with regard to Angel but I have Angel issues). First off, where did he get money for the wardrobe? I know that sounds like nitpicking but we deal all the time with his HUGE house, his very nice wardrobe including his giveaway stash of leather coats and yet other vampires have little or no income save what they steal from their victims. I would quote "The Freshmen" "A New Man" and the demon selling the books of ascention in season 3 as examples of the penniless evil. Secondly, where did he get that very boyish, mysterious charm as it was not his modus operandi as Angelus or even as his mortal self? There are a lot of changes, very radical ones to the Angel character from the Season 1 character concept that are very worthy of exploration.
Overall I loved the show and look forward to posting my thoughts as you guys work your way through one of my all time favorite series. Job well done!
Also on the same sort of note Joss does ask us to suspend our disbelief about how the outrside world hasn't noticed this tinky black hole in Southern California. Every once in a while Joss does deal with this though it does remain a point of suspended disbelief. I can remember "Gingerbread" where the town starts gettign together to say enough is enough. Also in "Hush" the news cast says the town has fallen to larengytis and is quarantined. Niether of these are great explinations but they do deal with the issue somewhat making sure it's not the elephant in the living room.
I also loved your commentary on Angel. It is clear that Angel was given his backstory late in the game after he was already established a character. However since we as the audience are now forced to shoehorn Angel into his old character. The "kill them all" line seems to be far too forcefull however his fear of the Master seems justified. Since having his soul he would have the impact of some of the horrors of the Master's work. Also he was rather shell shocked when we saw him meet (stalk) Buffy the first time with Whistler so his fear of the world seems to come from that. However we don't seem to get into what happened to make the scared, rat eating creature that was Angel become the enigmatic, smooth, makeup clad protagonist (Hero just doesn't work for me with regard to Angel but I have Angel issues). First off, where did he get money for the wardrobe? I know that sounds like nitpicking but we deal all the time with his HUGE house, his very nice wardrobe including his giveaway stash of leather coats and yet other vampires have little or no income save what they steal from their victims. I would quote "The Freshmen" "A New Man" and the demon selling the books of ascention in season 3 as examples of the penniless evil. Secondly, where did he get that very boyish, mysterious charm as it was not his modus operandi as Angelus or even as his mortal self? There are a lot of changes, very radical ones to the Angel character from the Season 1 character concept that are very worthy of exploration.
Overall I loved the show and look forward to posting my thoughts as you guys work your way through one of my all time favorite series. Job well done!
posted by: Miles on Fri, 8/26 12:56 PM EDT
Thank you, I have just discovered your podcast and I am encouraged by what i have heard so far. I have been listening to another that was far more juvenile and also tinged with homophobia. I am going to listen to all the podcasts to get caught up in the next few days. I will let you know what I think. After just the first two, I think that a co-host is needed, someone to bounce ideas off of.
I have just found your podcast and have only been able to listen to 1 and 2 so far...but what a refreshing show! Like the previous poster, I have been listening to another juvenile that pretty much describes Buffy episode by episode, but since we have seen each show, obviously don't need a play by play--but a true discussion is wonderful.
I was able to suspend disbelief enough when it came to Sunnydale being a small town--until, that is, it became a huge University town!
Looking forward to the next 11 casts and hoping there will be more. I am sorry that I missed Nov. 2 of 2005, but will be sure to raise a glass on Nov. 2 this year!
I was able to suspend disbelief enough when it came to Sunnydale being a small town--until, that is, it became a huge University town!
Looking forward to the next 11 casts and hoping there will be more. I am sorry that I missed Nov. 2 of 2005, but will be sure to raise a glass on Nov. 2 this year!
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Thanks!Dearest Revello,
This was in fact an excellent episode.
Although i am no stranger to buffy forums, it is truly an entirely different experience to be able to actually "hear" somebody discuss the many buffy themes and also to hear the varying imputs of the other listeners.
As a debut episode, i found it to be very thought provoking.
I have a deep long lasting love for BUFFY but have never really been the big thinker into the things that your show discusses.
I find it to be very valuable and appreciate it very much.
The idea of Joss asking the audience to "suspend belief" had never really occured to me. And as i began to think about it more, i really started to think...."Yeah. Why wasn't Xander crying over his best friend who JUST DIED!?" lol. 10 years too late to be asking that i know, lol.
Anyways...it's late. I'm tired.
Once again, great show. Love it very mucho.
I've only listened to eps 1-8 & 13.
I'm going to go listen to ep 9 right now as ur melodic voice lulls me peacefully to sleep.
ha! :-D
g'nite and take care buffycast!
so long and goodnight...
This was in fact an excellent episode.
Although i am no stranger to buffy forums, it is truly an entirely different experience to be able to actually "hear" somebody discuss the many buffy themes and also to hear the varying imputs of the other listeners.
As a debut episode, i found it to be very thought provoking.
I have a deep long lasting love for BUFFY but have never really been the big thinker into the things that your show discusses.
I find it to be very valuable and appreciate it very much.
The idea of Joss asking the audience to "suspend belief" had never really occured to me. And as i began to think about it more, i really started to think...."Yeah. Why wasn't Xander crying over his best friend who JUST DIED!?" lol. 10 years too late to be asking that i know, lol.
Anyways...it's late. I'm tired.
Once again, great show. Love it very mucho.
I've only listened to eps 1-8 & 13.
I'm going to go listen to ep 9 right now as ur melodic voice lulls me peacefully to sleep.
ha! :-D
g'nite and take care buffycast!
so long and goodnight...
posted by: The Lonely Slayer on Sat, 10/20 04:07 AM EDT
Hi, i just discovered this podcast today and am refreshed to hear discussion about issues in Buffy, rather than just an episode by episode commentary that inevitably boils down to "Oh, I just LOVE the moment when..." however many times we may have conversations like that. Phew, long opening line.
Anyway, i don't know how valuable writing on the board of a podcast made four years ago is going to be but what the heck. 2 points struck me about the points you made:
1) Like The Lonely Slayer above, I can't believe how little thought I've put into how quickly Xander and Willow get over Jesse - it's jokes all round the night after they dust a best friend.
2) The whole souls/demons infection/take over thing has always seemed a loose complex in Buffy really giving the license to let the writers do whatever they need to. Most vampires are characterless monsters who seem to just want to feed on blood. They dress badly, have no money and are always in game face. Then there are vamps like Darla who seem to show obvious character traits from when they were human (how similar is Darla on her death-bed from the flash-back in the Angel episode "Darla" to the Darla vampire?), show real emotional connection to one another (Spike and Dru) and have money and fine clothes (Angelus). Why is it that if you're from Britain or really old you're automatically an awesome vamp with character while all the others are such total demonic losers? Some are pitifully pathetic, like the one human Darla tries to pick up to turn her into a vampire in the Angel episode "The Trial". Is the idea there that the demon personality inside him is actually a complete dork, or is that his human precusor shining through? What about Angel. Flashbacks from episodes like "Amends" make him look like a drunken lout (closer to Spike than Angelus) but then he quickly becomes a Hannibal-Lector style killing-is-my-art-form kinda guy, while tender, thoughtful William becomes drunken reveller Spike. Here the character of the demon seems very different to the human before. All in all, this demon inhabiting the body thing has always seemed loose allowing the writers the license to do whatever they want for whichever scenario they need.
Anyway, looking forward to hearing the rest of the podcasts and i will almost certainly ramble some more after those as well.
Anyway, i don't know how valuable writing on the board of a podcast made four years ago is going to be but what the heck. 2 points struck me about the points you made:
1) Like The Lonely Slayer above, I can't believe how little thought I've put into how quickly Xander and Willow get over Jesse - it's jokes all round the night after they dust a best friend.
2) The whole souls/demons infection/take over thing has always seemed a loose complex in Buffy really giving the license to let the writers do whatever they need to. Most vampires are characterless monsters who seem to just want to feed on blood. They dress badly, have no money and are always in game face. Then there are vamps like Darla who seem to show obvious character traits from when they were human (how similar is Darla on her death-bed from the flash-back in the Angel episode "Darla" to the Darla vampire?), show real emotional connection to one another (Spike and Dru) and have money and fine clothes (Angelus). Why is it that if you're from Britain or really old you're automatically an awesome vamp with character while all the others are such total demonic losers? Some are pitifully pathetic, like the one human Darla tries to pick up to turn her into a vampire in the Angel episode "The Trial". Is the idea there that the demon personality inside him is actually a complete dork, or is that his human precusor shining through? What about Angel. Flashbacks from episodes like "Amends" make him look like a drunken lout (closer to Spike than Angelus) but then he quickly becomes a Hannibal-Lector style killing-is-my-art-form kinda guy, while tender, thoughtful William becomes drunken reveller Spike. Here the character of the demon seems very different to the human before. All in all, this demon inhabiting the body thing has always seemed loose allowing the writers the license to do whatever they want for whichever scenario they need.
Anyway, looking forward to hearing the rest of the podcasts and i will almost certainly ramble some more after those as well.
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